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Maurice Levy: What are your memories about the Pittsburgh Musical
Institute? I, um, interviewed one of the eldest daughter of Charles Boyd a
couple of weeks ago. Marjorie, right. Right. Marjorie. And what what do you
recall of your experience at the Pittsburgh Musical Institute?
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Carl McVicker: Well, the old building down there was next to the to the
old WQED on Bellefield Avenue
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Levy: Oh, that's right, they made us. They made us get, uh, a permission
from the school board to go out and earn a living to supplement the money
that we couldn't, that we didn't make very much money with. And they asked
us permission. Yeah, they made us ask permission.
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McVicker: I never turned me down, but I always had to have it right. And
they could have, uh.
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Levy: Uh, I remember a lot of us used to resent the fact they paid us
those coolie wages. Then we asked to supplement them. We had to get
permission to supplement. That's right. Which was sort of ironic. Yeah.
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McVicker: Well, Doctor Boyd was a. Id say the head of it. President.
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Levy: He was one of the founders. He did, you know? Well, with Dallmeyer
Russell.
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McVicker: Dallmeyer Russell was the director. And Mr. Oetting, I forget
his first name. He had two daughters. One of them became a teacher. Both of
them became. Members of the faculty out at Westinghouse. One of them was a
librarian. One of them taught one of the subjects. At Westinghouse.
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Levy: It.
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McVicker: The Oetting girls.
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Levy: Oh, the Oetting Girls.
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McVicker: And he had a complete staff, of very good teachers. Gaylord Yost
was head of the violin department. And. The reverse ones. Very fine
teachers. But towards the end. We. We open build up all the fraternities at
Pitt being built up, you know, nobody could find a place to park. I'd leave
Westinghouse and I'd drive around all over Oakland trying to find a place
to park. So finally they just gave up and sold out because they didn't have
enough students to make it worthwhile.
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Levy: The school was slowly, gradually winding down. Was that it that.
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McVicker: They used to be connected with Pitt and they could get their
music credits through Pitt.
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Levy: But did did Pitt begin to build their music department up and did
that? No, no.
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McVicker: No, that was just an adjunct. I'd say Pitt music department was
going downhill. Wasn't much. You couldn't get a degree in music at Pitt
because that group went over to Carnegie Tech. You know what I told you
about?
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Levy: That's right. Because they had.
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McVicker: They are trying to build it up now with Nathan Davis. But that's
strictly a jazz outfit.
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Levy: But they have some they have some classical teaching there, I
believe, because I have a friend who teaches the piano there.
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McVicker: Cant get a degree in it, can you?
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Levy: I really don't know, I dont know but they have they have a number
of classical concert free and concerts in the year over at Frick Fine Arts.
Natalie Phillips. I don't know if you know that name. You know the
Phillips, uh, her, uh, uh, two boys are professional violinists.
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McVicker: Yes, I'm familiar. Phillips name.
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Levy: Eugene, played for the symphony. Right. And Natalie taught at Pitt.
And she was. She is a private teacher, very fine teacher. And, uh, their
two sons are are very fine musicians. Uh, went up and plays at the 92nd
Street Y in New York. In fact, they formed their own quartet, the Orion
Quartet. The uh so the PMI had what was range of things that they taught
there. Was it just a standard music subject of.
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McVicker: Harmony, Theory in general and uh. Mostlly uh proficiency on
their instrument. They taught Organ. Doctor Boyd had a heart attack right
at the organ. He had one of the finest musicological libraries in the in
the Pittsburgh area.
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Levy: Yes. He donated it to to the Carnegie Library. It's part of our
music division there. He had over 2000 volumes, over 2000 volumes, 3000, 2
or 3000. His youngest daughter comes in as a volunteer, and she's helping
to go through the collection there. Yes, yes. Eileen. Eileen Hutchinson.
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McVicker: I love that family.
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Levy: Yes.
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McVicker: Eileen was a pretty girl.
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Levy: She still is an attractive woman. Is she? Yes, she's. They remember
you. They remember you, Marjorie. Marjorie talked about you when I talked
to her.
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McVicker: Charming girls. Yes. I loved their father. Don't. I Just met
another. Can't remember too much what she looks like.
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Levy: You dealt with him? You did. You did some teaching there?
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McVicker: Yes, I taught there.
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Levy: You taught trumpet there?
McVicker: Yes, I taught trumpet there. 3 or 4 days a week. Yes. When I
taught at the Boys Club Pittsburgh Boys Club for several years. Night
nights that I didn't teach at PMI. I taught at the Boys Club, had the band
there. Band classes at Lawrenceville until the director died. Those were
weird years too. I gave up the band down there at the Boys Club, and the
war came on in 1940 and the. Right. The. Director of the Boys Club, Jimmy
Lodge became the. Head of the Russian[?] board down there. I said I. I'll
come back and teach a man if you can get me a gasoline. He said how much do
you need.
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Levy: Oh, this must be during the war, when it was was rationed.
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McVicker: Give me b book.
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Levy: You got a B book? Really?
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McVicker: Avis, a standard book.
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Levy: That was four gallons a week, right? Wasn't that four gallons?
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McVicker: That's hardly what my average gas tank those days. But isn't
that strange from my big job at Westinghouse? I mean, the full time job.
Hey, eight tickets and. Have a [?] for a week and for this part time job
down at the Boys Club. All I need really. I went to Nashville Music Camp as
a counselor the summer of 1945.
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Levy: And which one was that? Is that the one in Interlochen?
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McVicker: Interlochen? Yes. That was a wonderful summer I had there. And.
I was up there and I parked my car under the tree and somebody said,
McVicker. Uh, I noticed you aren't using your car. I said, no, I just got
barely enough gas to get home. They give me special gas to get up here
because I had one of my pupils, Frank Ostrowski, along with me.
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Levy: He played trumpet.
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McVicker: He was first from the Pittsburgh Symphony for a while. Now he's
a booker for, uh, Benedum. Tries out the positions for them. This
contractor for it. Anyway. They said, well, go and see the superintendent
of the camp. Get you all the gas you want. I went around to see if he gave
me B book. He said, this is Republican territory up here. We don't. There's
lots of gas, he said in the tanks around.
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Levy: So you were at PMI Pittsburgh Musical Institute. How long? How long
were you there?
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McVicker: Just like I started in 1936. 35 or 6. I think of the. It might
have been before that. We'll call it a middle 30s. I'll tell you why I
remember 36, because that's, uh. When the Institute of the Social Security.
I took it from there instead of the Westinghouse.
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Levy: That's right. Because the teachers, uh, didn't pay Social Security.
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McVicker: At that time. You had the option of taking Social Security on a
reduced basis. Now, like your pension will be, will say, $300 a month,
which that's what mine was, 296 and I retired 61. And at that time, if you
had taken Social Security. I'd cut in at 65. Then you took your school
pension. I was 57. I retired from Westinghouse. I had 36 years in teaching.
34 there. And so what they did then they paid you your full pension until
you're 65. Then Social Security came in and they cut you down like you.
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Levy: Have had an offset. It's called an offset.
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McVicker: I'd get 200 from a pension. 100 from Social Security. And
several years after that the teachers were given the option of paying in
paying back.
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Levy: That's right. But actually, that came about right near the end
before. Just before you retired. I remember when that happened. We had
people who had a chance to pay back. Uh. Ten quarters and they would become
fully member of the retirement thing.
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McVicker: Didnt amount to several thousand dollars, in some cases
several hundred and others. Yeah.
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Levy: For some of the people it didn't amount to much, but I can recall I
had nothing to do with music. It was interesting the way, uh, I remember I
was at Westinghouse at the time and we were trying to we had to get it. We
had to get a majority. Yeah. Remember we voted on that. That was in 1955 or
56. And some people, one one lady said to me, I don't take anything for
nothing. I've been self-sufficient all my life and I just couldn't convince
her.
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McVicker: That sounds like my father in law, my son, my brother in law
talked to him. He said, well, this is ridiculous. This is not charity. This
is an insurance.
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Levy: That's money that you contributed yourself. Yeah. So, so the and you
were at PMI from the middle 30s until, until the.
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McVicker: Until they closed up.
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Levy: Which was about. Uh, middle 40s.
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McVicker: Oh, no. Closed up around 19, about the time I retired.
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Levy: Oh, really? It went through the late 50s and early 60s.
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McVicker: Yeah, I retired in 61. I think they're still going in I'd say
about the middle 60s.
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Levy: Okay, so you were there at least 25 years? Yes, about 25 years. What
do you remember of Dallmeyer Russell? Oh, very well. What kind of what do
you remember of him?
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McVicker: His daughter.
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Levy: Uh, his daughter is, uh. I'm. I'm supposed to. I'm going to
interview her, I hope. Lucretia. Lucretia. Yeah, right. But do you
remember? Was he a piano?
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McVicker: A piano duo, very talented group. He was always very friendly
with me.
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Levy: He taught piano at the at the Institute.
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McVicker: After PMI closed up, she kept the name going a little while from
her home in the in the Highland area.
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Levy: The her name now I think is Maraschino.
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McVicker: Yeah. She married a sax and clarinet man, I knew him. He was one
of her pupils down there at PMI. Before she met him, and I had his brother
as a trumpet pupil with the GI Bill.
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Levy: Who was that? The Maraschino brother.
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McVicker: Maraschinos brother.
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Levy: The Dallmeyer Russell was a piano teacher. And did he do anything
else beside them? Was that primary.
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McVicker: That was the primary work that was.
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Levy: Primary because he was one of the founders of it. Right? How many
people have taught there at its height?
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McVicker: How many people altogether.
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Levy: Yeah at PMI about.
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McVicker: We'll Ill see around two dozen.
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Levy: Really? It was a pretty good sized school there. We must have had
several hundred students. Yes.
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McVicker: Oh, yes. Because they had a branch at Wilkinsburg and a branch
up in Mount Lebanon. I had more pupils than I could handle. I had a hassle
with Mr. Oetting one time about it and said, you're turning down pupils
here. I said, I just don't have room for them.
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Levy: And you, you gave them when you taught, did you teach them on a on
an individual basis or in a small group basis?
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McVicker: Everything.
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Levy: Individual everything. And throughout the Institute that generally
was it. It was a one on one.
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McVicker: That's the way it was done. I don't know of any classwork.
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Levy: There were no no.
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McVicker: Class classes were in harmony and so on. There was a big GI
Bill, a group of students here after.
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Levy: Well that must have kept them going. Then for a while.
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McVicker: They did.
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Levy: Yeah.
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McVicker: Some of those students were getting more money for taking
lessons, and then the teacher for giving it because it got cost of living.
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Levy: That's right. Whether they were paid, the tuition was paid. At the
beginning it was $65 a month. They gave them, and then it went to $75,
which was a fair sum of money for a college student back in the back in the
late.
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McVicker: Remember, those were the days I would come down there after
getting through the Westinghouse, be down there about ready to start
teaching about a quarter of four, 4:00, teach the dinner time. And I went
in there one time and I smelled a funny smell, like burning ropes. And I
asked one of my pupils, he was a black man. I said, what's that funny
smell? He says, man, don't you know what that is? I forget the various
names he had for it. Rope and, uh. And pot and candy. I think he said
that's that's pot man. I said, what's that? He said, marijuana.
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Levy: Yeah. Some of them called it Mary Jane. I remember that was one of
the names for it. Weed. Right, right.
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McVicker: That came out. I came out so wonder I wasn't arrested.
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Levy: Well, you were, you were lived in a different musicians world than
the than the the people who smoked it. Yeah. Because, uh, remember the
scandal with the, uh. Uh, Gene Krupa, remember? And today, of course,
it's.
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McVicker: Well, at Westinhouse uh, in the 40s. You don't remember because
you weren't there. But but anyway, Westinghouse Stage Band called the
Cadets were very popular at that time. From there on to about the middle of
the 50s. After that, the blacks didn't want anything to do with it because
they wanted rhythm and blues. But anyway, I found out my stage band, half
of them were on heroin and marijuana. Really? Now one of my boys. I won't
mention any names. I was directing fourth period orchestra, the senior
orchestra, and he was a very good clarinet player. I was directing on there
and all of a sudden he went down like that. I rapped on my stand and.
What's the matter with so and so passed out? One of you? Well, one of you
fellows back there said his friends. You know. Will you help me carry him
over to the nurses room? They said oh Mr. McVicker. Don't pay any attention
to him. Let's just go ahead and direct him. You'll be all right in five
minutes. Well, I smelled a rat then. I had no idea what it was, and. Just
clarinet across his lap like that and his head down. Pretty soon.
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Levy: Then he woke up and picked the clarinet, picked the clarinet up
again, and what had.
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McVicker: Been going on the orchestra was at noon. And the their lunch
period. My lunch period was 11:20 up until ten minutes to 12, actually 5 to
12. And the bell rang. And after they ate lunch, those guys would go to the
boys room and smoke marijuana. And he was just out. So I said, don't let
anybody ever tell me that marijuana is harmless. I said, If I'd been
driving next to him on the parkway, he'd a kill me. Good. Clear out of
control. He was clear out.
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Levy: What about the In-and- Around Pittsburgh Music Educators Club? What
was that?
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McVicker: That was a group of, uh. Instrumental teachers and vocal. Got
together as kind of a social group as well as a.
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Levy: Professional.
McVicker: Professional might say yes. And we'd always have. A little. A
social time, you know, desserts and sometimes regular times you have a
dinner. Like when the when the. You mentioned the follow who, wrote The
Music Man.
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Levy: Meredith Willson.
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McVicker: Meredith Willson followed like that and. Colonel Howard, the
director of the Air Force Band, became a friend of mine, put me responsible
for putting my son in his band in Washington, D.C. so we had special
speakers like that. But we met once a month. And when I was president,
about that time, we had, uh. Prize winning groups play down at Carnegie
Hall. So people could hear who had the superior band ratings around
orchestras. That's when I had my orchestra playing down at Carnegie Hall.
Brought people in from all over area. Then after a shortly, after I
retired, it died out.
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Levy: So it lasted. How long did you belong to? Did you recall?
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McVicker: I belonged to it practically all my professional years, I don't
know.
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Levy: So it probably, it probably it was around in the 20s then maybe.
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McVicker: Yes it was. I'd say it was about the time I started. I started i
was 27. We'll see the 30s and 40s and 50s.
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Levy: Mostly, mostly music educators in the Pittsburgh public schools. Or
was it from the surrounding areas too.
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McVicker: Area all around?
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Levy: I know, in other words, people out in the county, yes, belong to
it.
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McVicker: That's probably why it fell apart, because. Got so widespread.
And that seemed to lack interest too. I remember somebody said when I
became president, they had a feeling like I would try to stimulate it and
get it going again, which I did. And after that it went. Well, 11[?] could
tell you more about that because by that time. People quit coming.
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Levy: Y'all have to ask him. I'll ask him what he remembers about the
club.
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McVicker: Because he had a name for him. Uh, after I retired, he called
him the Down and Outers.
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Levy: Instead of the Youth and the Rounders.
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McVicker: Down and Outers. Yeah, so it did lose. Papa.
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Levy: Well, I. Guess there's a lifespan to most of those things. And the
young ones don't bring the same, I guess the same interest that the
original. Eventually it dies out.
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McVicker: We used to have. Dinners down at Stover's, and really, I always
looked forward to them. My wife and I would go to them. It would bring
people in from Washington County, Greene County, Westmoreland all around.
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Levy: And there was less. There was less competition for your time. No TV
and, uh, the, uh. That's right. Right. That, uh, uh, that was something to
do was an evening's entertainment. I mean, the other option was to stay
home and listen to Jack Benny on the radio. That was or or go to, uh.
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McVicker: Seems like, uh, we became more highly segregated. After a while.
All band directors, all orchestra directors, all choral directors.
00:20:51.000 --> 00:20:54.000
Levy: Oh, I see, you mean in the in the group itself?
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McVicker: In the in the county area? Yeah. It seemed like the. Are you?
You would have your PMEA affairs.
00:21:05.000 --> 00:21:08.000
Levy: That's the Pennsylvania Music Educators Association. Is that what
that is?
00:21:08.000 --> 00:21:34.000
McVicker: That would draw the band directors together. Then they had the
orchestra concerts would draw them and the choirs, but they were all hard
to any cases where they same directors, most of them the band director, was
a band director. Some orchestra directors were band directors, but choir
directors were mostly all choir. But you know about you know about all
people together.
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Levy: Nobody had a life expectancy of a life span of maybe 35, 40 years or
maybe longer, but a.
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McVicker: Lot of it. Because Carnegie Tech seemed to lose its influence
over. But that particular time Carnegie Tech seemed to have the tentacles
out all the schools around.
00:21:54.000 --> 00:21:59.000
Levy: And was that is that the most influential of the music schools in
the area, would you say.
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McVicker: At that time yeah.
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Levy: And then Duquesne came along later.
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McVicker: I was a critic teacher for Duquesne and Carnegie Tech. Finally,
I guess I had to, I don't know, as I made the choice, but. Since I was a
Tech graduate, they sent me to Carnegie Tech. Because I had them for most
departments for a while. So nothing from Pitt, ever.
00:22:29.000 --> 00:22:32.000
Levy: But I don't recall Pitt ever sending any.
00:22:32.000 --> 00:22:34.000
McVicker: I didn't have a music department. Per se.
00:22:34.000 --> 00:22:51.000
Levy: And I don't know what they. I don't even know what the. Specifics
are now. Well, we'll get around to asking somebody down there exactly what
they're doing at the university because, uh, Carnegie Tech. Carnegie Mellon
went through the period of where they dropped music education for a while.
00:22:51.000 --> 00:22:57.000
McVicker: Yes, it did.
Levy: And they tried to become a conservatory. Isn't that correct? But
now
00:22:57.000 --> 00:22:59.000
McVicker: Institute. Is a music department.
00:22:59.000 --> 00:23:03.000
Levy: Now they've revived it under this Marilyn Taft Thomas.
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McVicker: I don't know what kind of luck she's going to have when you pay
1500 $15,000 a year for tuition.
00:23:10.000 --> 00:23:13.000
Levy: It's close to 20,000.
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McVicker: In board and room. Are you going to pay 20,000? That's right.
And it's a five year course. Well, now you're talking big money. And they
come out. One of my friends told me about their daughter trying to get a
job. So there are 2200 after one job. 2200. And you've invested, say,
$75,000 to get an education. You'd have to be a supreme optimist to think
that you're going to have a payback on that.
00:23:47.000 --> 00:24:14.000
Levy: Yeah. Well, that's that, of course, is because of the nature of the
population dip. And the high schools will be rebuilding, I understand. Uh,
the so-called population pimple is up in the upper elementary grades, and
which means the high schools will be rebuilt. Uh, as you know,
Westinghouse, the population is very low. Peabody's below a thousand. We
had. Right. We had we had 30, 3100 when I began.
00:24:14.000 --> 00:24:21.000
McVicker: When I went to Westinghouse. We had 3200 six year school. That's
right. Now that's below a thousand.
00:24:21.000 --> 00:24:45.000
Levy: But we had 3200 at Peabody, 3100 for four year school. And now it's
below a thousand. But that will come back up because the elementary schools
are getting crowded again. There was a population dip for a number of
years, and the there was they're starting to replenish. And I guess jobs
will be available again. But it's going to be a while because there aren't
very many, uh, secondary jobs.
00:24:45.000 --> 00:24:47.000
McVicker: Fell in the hole through the cracks.
00:24:47.000 --> 00:24:54.000
Levy: Well, they so-called the talking about trying to lay off some people
in the Pittsburgh public schools.
00:24:54.000 --> 00:25:22.000
McVicker: My sons. Have been working with Volkweins, you know, as well as
playing Jack Purcell at night. He's given up at Volkweins here. He's going
to do Volkweins work down in Florida. Selling the music, lining up the
teachers any way. He's been reported for several years. His friends in the
school business around here very disillusioned. They can hardly wait. They
just take the minimum requirement to retire.
00:25:22.000 --> 00:25:26.000
Levy: Really? And that mean outside the city?
00:25:26.000 --> 00:25:54.000
McVicker: Yeah, outside the city. He doesn't know anything about in the
city because his friend Randy Purcell, you know Jacks son, where he
played for men in Ferguson for several years. I can't stand Maynard
Ferguson trumpet playing, screeching around and everything, but, uh, uh,
Randy went into this school down there, you know? Fifth, fifth and. Penn
Avenue. What's the name of that? Middle school.
00:25:54.000 --> 00:25:55.000
Levy: Uh Reizenstein.
00:25:55.000 --> 00:26:12.000
McVicker: Reizenstein. Do you know how they greeted him? He got up to
direct the band. When they greet him this way. Motherfuker. Motherfuker. He
told them. He said, don't ever ask me to be a substitute.
00:26:12.000 --> 00:26:41.000
Levy: Well, I've received him. A friend of mine who's a jazz, we go over
to Carnegie Mellon and listen to his, uh, jazz band that he has there.
Yeah, they had they had a, uh, two years ago. They had something called,
uh, jazz chamber music, and he had duos, trios, quartets, quintets and
septets all over, uh, and they each played several pieces. And he had the
kids. He does a very good job. I oh.
00:26:41.000 --> 00:26:42.000
McVicker: Yes, he's good at that.
00:26:42.000 --> 00:26:50.000
Levy: He apparently he's a very good teacher. Improvisation. I, I think,
uh, a good bit of it was improvisation, I don't recall.
00:26:50.000 --> 00:26:54.000
McVicker: I heard his Stage band. They sounded good in the old days of the
professional band. Yes.
00:26:54.000 --> 00:26:57.000
Levy: We heard the stage band. Although I'm like you down there.
00:26:57.000 --> 00:26:58.000
McVicker: By the way.
00:26:58.000 --> 00:27:05.000
Levy: He's quit. Quit is he. Is that is that permanent? Because he left in
the middle of the tour last spring.
00:27:05.000 --> 00:27:26.000
McVicker: Did you hear anything about that?
Levy: No, I just I know that a friend of mine, we were supposed to go to a
concert. We marked our calendars and, and, uh, I happened to be walking
through the campus, and it said that the jazz band concert for the
following Thursday night at the alumni concert Hall is cancelled. And. That
was the end of it. And then there was a little hum.
00:27:26.000 --> 00:27:27.000
McVicker: There was a big hassle with him.
00:27:27.000 --> 00:27:28.000
Levy: Is that what there was?
00:27:28.000 --> 00:27:29.000
McVicker: Yeah.
00:27:29.000 --> 00:28:03.000
Levy: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Uh, we went to hear I had a former student of mine
who was a very fine master, and he played, uh, he played the trumpet.
Played the trumpet there for for, uh, Randy. Uh, but we could only handle
about half of it because he started to play that fusion music, which is
part rock and part, uh, big band. And I try to be as, uh, as tolerant as I
can of modern forms of music, but the merit of that just escapes me, just
escapes me.
00:28:03.000 --> 00:28:05.000
McVicker: Couldn't sit through that stuff.
00:28:05.000 --> 00:28:11.000
Levy: Aside from the fact that they they amplify it beyond.
00:28:11.000 --> 00:28:36.000
McVicker: Oh, isn't that horrible? Well, they're going to have a bunch of
deaf people in this country. I had a former pupil got a very fine trumpet
player, and he went to West Virginia University, and he got out, and he was
one of the finest transposers I ever had. And all he could get was a rock
and roll band. And he said the drummer said back up and he had to sit there
and he.
00:28:36.000 --> 00:28:37.000
Levy: Put his put a.
00:28:37.000 --> 00:28:38.000
McVicker: Earmuffs on.
00:28:38.000 --> 00:28:40.000
Levy: That's right. Really?
00:28:40.000 --> 00:28:48.000
McVicker: And I said, imagine playing trumpet with the plugs in your ears,
but you'd be deaf. And he's half my age.
00:28:48.000 --> 00:28:49.000
Levy: All right.
McVicker: Hes not doing it now.
00:28:49.000 --> 00:29:07.000
Levy: But I know you're not in the band. Well, I'd like to thank you for
really a marvelous interview. You've taken us through 60 years, almost 60
years of music in the in the Pittsburgh area and the wide variety of your
experiences. And I'd like to thank you again.
00:29:07.000 --> 00:29:21.000
McVicker: You're certainly welcome. It's been a wonderful, nostalgic trip
for me, and I can't tell you how much it's meant to me, bringing back
memories that I had put in the back of my mind or thought I'd never
resurrect.
00:29:21.000 --> 00:29:45.000
Levy: Well, you're one of the as we say, this. This project is for
prominent musicians, and you have really educated and prepared hundreds, if
not thousands, maybe thousands of people to if all they did was like music,
you were successful. Do you agree with that, that if they came out of, uh,
your teaching with a love for music?
00:29:45.000 --> 00:29:52.000
McVicker: I've had a very happy career in music. I never made, never made
the big money. As I've told.
00:29:52.000 --> 00:29:53.000
Levy: Well, it's our.
00:29:53.000 --> 00:29:54.000
McVicker: Mind, but.
00:29:54.000 --> 00:30:06.000
Levy: It's our pleasure to to be able to record your reminiscences and to
have future people listen to somebody who really was one of the great,
great music teachers in Pittsburgh. Thank you.
00:30:06.000 --> 00:30:11.000
McVicker: Thanks for very much for permitting me to share my memories with
you.
00:30:11.000 --> 00:31:11.000
Levy: Thank you again.
