WEBVTT
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Jim Barrett [Barrett]: Okay. This morning, I'm talking with [um] Catherine
O'Connor [O'Connor]: Catherine. C-A-T-H-E-R-I-N-E Right. Barrett: And we're
at 7080 17th [inaudable]. You were just telling me about your Scottish
accent.
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O'Connor: We came to the, shall I start? Is it on now?
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Barrett: Yeah, it's on.
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O'Connor: Yeah. We came to the United States in 1913. Month, in the month
of October. And my parents and their eight children.
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Barrett: Oh, big family.
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O'Connor: We landed at Ellis Island. We had to stay there for a day and a
night. Till they cleared us. Then go down the Baltimore and Ohio train and
instead of the Pennsylvania. And it took a day and a night that, a day and
a night to come
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From New York, to, Pittsburgh.
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Barrett: So you came straight here then? O'Connor: Yes. And where did your
family first live?
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O'Connor: We lived on Ann[??] street. Homestead. 1108 Ann Street in
Homestead.
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Barrett: And what did your dad do when you.
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O'Connor: When he was in Scotland. He was a superintendent of a small
rolling mill. Gardner. Ayrshire, Scotland.
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Barrett: I know Scotland a little bit, so some of the places that you
mentioned I'll probably perhaps know.
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O'Connor: Which is about ten miles from Glasgow. Barrett: Okay.
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Barrett: When you said Glasgow, I could hear your accent a little bit.
Okay.
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Now I know what you mean. [laughing] And.
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O'Connor: The reason, we came to this country after, one reached the sixth
grade, there was nowhere to go. Unless we went to a convent school. The
girls, or brothers. Marist Brothers School for the Boys. And my parents
thought we should have a choice. We'll have to go back a little. Once you
got to the, convent school or the brothers school. You. They latched on to
you. Very seldom you became a priest. Barrett: Oh, really? O'Connor: Or you
became a nun because weren't, there weren't too many Catholics in the area
and they needed the religious to be, amplified.
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Barrett: Yeah. Yeah.
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O'Connor: So my parents thought we should have our own
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O'Connor: Choice. Barrett: And so, what they.
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O'Connor: And so we came to Homestead. And the reason we came to
Homestead, my aunt and uncle. Mr.. Mrs.. James Thompson had already come
here because of the mills.
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The steel mill. They came here.
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O'Connor: And we [uh]. So my father tried and tried to get into the US
Steel and at that time. Oh my gosh, you see this sort of, Catholics
couldn't get anywhere. It was a long time before he got a job and he just
got a, he got a job as a labourer in the [uh] Blacksmith shop.
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Barrett: So I wonder if that'd be, like, skilled work or not.
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O'Connor: No, it wasn't. It wasn't anything that, he was capable of being
a, a ruler.
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But [uh] they didn't give him a good job. He just had labor job.
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Barrett: So you think maybe as late as even the time when you came in
1913, there was some discrimination against Catholics? O'Connor: Yes.
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O'Connor: Maybe I shouldn't say that.
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Barrett: No, well, it sounds logical to me. And it's happened a lot of
places before. I'm Catholic, but we grew up in a big Catholic neighborhood
in Chicago. And so I never had to feel anything like that. But I'm sure
other people.
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O'Connor: Um, so he. He worked there until 1952. And he got a disability
pension because part of the arteries, etcetera.
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Barrett: But did he stay in that kind of a job or what?
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O'Connor: He never got any farther. Barrett: huh? O'Connor: Never got any
farther. And such a brain as he had for steel. Barrett: Yeah. O'Connor: But
it was handed down to, one of my brothers. And my mother said that, never
would any of her children work in the steel mill if she could help it.
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Barrett: Why did she feel that way?
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O'Connor: Well. It's hard work. And she thought that there there they had
very good minds, and they should be doing something better than working in
the steel mill.
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Barrett: What kind of education did the kids in your family end up with?
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O'Connor: Well, my. My oldest brother, James, he went to Saint Mungo's in
Glasgow. He was [uh]. When he got through the eighth [uh] sixth grade.
Sixth grade is the equivalent there to eighth grade here. Barrett: [Mhm]
O'Connor: And when he finished sixth grade, he won what they call, a
bursary, which is equivalent to a scholarship. Barrett: Yeah I recognized
that. O'Connor: So he went to Glasgow to Saint Mungo's Catholic. Then when
we all came out here, he, he worked in the shipping department in the US
Steel. As a clerk. Lloyd's of London, asked US Steel if they could
recommend a young man--to start from the bottom, for them. And they
recommended him. So he went from there, to Cleveland for Lloyd's of London.
Then he went from London-- from Cleveland to Philadelphia, and then he went
from Philadelphia to New York. And he was in charge of the office in New
York. Worked himself up the years, and he is a very, very clever person.
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Barrett: So he was doing insurance work then?
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O'Connor: No, Loyd's, no, that was-- This is the-- area he was in. U.S.
Steel would make steel for these ships. Barrett: [Uha] O'Connor: And they
had surveyed what they called surveyors to come in, to check-- the [uh]--
the steel to make sure that it was okay to go into the ships. Barrett:
Right. O'Connor: And that was-- the area he was in. Barrett: Oh I see,
yeah.
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Barrett: So it-- was it that [stammering][uh] Lloyd Lloyd's London is a
big insurance company? O'Connor: Yes. Barrett: So those were the ships that
they were going to.
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O'Connor: Well [uh] well, when companies would build ships, but they had
to pass-- the year. --Well that the [uh] steel to make sure there were no
flaws in it. Barrett: Yeah. Yeah. O'Connor: And [uh]. So that's what he
did. And that was my oldest brother, and my brother, Pat-- he got a job
with Union Switch and Signal. And so it was Swissvale. Barrett: Yeah. You
worked there for a long time. Then you went into the real estate and
insurance business. -- And then he was appointed [uh] Magistrate of
Braddock, Pennsylvania. Barrett: [Mhm] O'Connor: And he had his real estate
and insurance office. And he was also the magistrate--
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[Uhm] For Bradock. A justice of the peace [inaudible] we call him.
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O'Connor: So then you-- His children all went to California to live. So he
and his wife, they decided to go out there and that's where he is now. He's
in Fullerton. My brother James is still in New York.
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He lives with his daughter and her family.
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Barrett: What about your sisters? What did they.
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O'Connor: Then my sister-- my oldest sister, Mary-- she-- bottles,
cosmetics for HU[??] O'donnell, who had three--Drugstores.
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And she bought the perfumes and the lipstick and all that she was.
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O'Connor: For his three one in Duquesne and one in McKeesport and one in
Homestead. These drugs. Then she married and didn't work after that. She
died in childbirth in, 1937. Having a second child. My other
sister--Margaret-- She worked for the president of the Monongahela Trust
Company. She was his secretary. It was formerly, Monongahela Trust Company
out of Homestead. Then they. Then she married. And it didn't work to
that[??] or to the end[??]. And Monongahela Trust Company dissolved, and
now it's Pittsburgh National Bank. In their.
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O'Connor: Borders. Barrett: Oh I see. I didn't know that.
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O'Connor: And so. And I. Barrett: You come next. O'Connor: I had a varied
career. I was-- first-- First I taught school for a year during the
Depression. Because they couldn't get us to go teach at First Saint Peter
and Paul's church. And I was taken out of.
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[Uh] I think I was a freshman in high school.
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O'Connor: And I taught that year.
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Barrett: Saint Peter and Paul's. You're young then, when you were--
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O'Connor: I was only about 14. 13, 14. And I was conned into that. This
Grace Moroney, who was the sister of-- Mayor of Homestead. She was the one
that pushed me into that. And I was so angry because I wanted to finish
high school. Barrett: Yeah. O'Connor: So I taught there for a year. Then I
went with Bell telephone for a while.
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After that. And then I went with-- Caughmans[??] or Hoffmans[??] and for
the--
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O'Connor: You had all the decorators out there.
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Barrett: Is that like secretarial work?
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O'Connor: Yes, I did. Oh, I went to a-- first I went to-- First I taught
in that school, then I went to-- Dufftower[??] in city for coffee. You know
shorthand time. Then I went to-- I didn't have a high school diploma. Then
I went to Pittsburgh Academy
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in High school to get my High School diploma. Then I worked for--
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O'Connor: Mr. Trump in the advertising he was. And I saw an ad. Another
girl had work there. And I saw an ad in the paper. I wasn't getting enough
money to suit me then. And we went down for an interview to this-- Teal
Rose and son[??]. They were transmission and belting company. And then
there was a couple of big benches and all these girls were sitting there.
You know who got the job? I did. And I don't even want the job. We did it
for a lark. Yeah. Yeah. And but it was a lot more money than I was getting
in.
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Barrett: But same type of work, same type.
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O'Connor: Nurse and Mr. McCreary and Rose and. They taught me how to
figure. Belts or transmission and pulleys. And they just they they just sat
down and they taught me all that they could go out sailing and leave me
there. And I could sell the pulleys and the belts and everything. Yeah. And
so then I worked there for. 3 or 4 years until Mr. Rose embezzled the
money. And then they dissolved that company and they let everybody go
except me. And then. Said that over two summers. Finland. Todd. They
started to handle.
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I stayed on and I.
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O'Connor: At that time, I got $120 a month. And that was exorbitant for a
girl. Yeah. And I was sworn to secrecy that I would not tell anybody. How
much. $120 a month. Because the other girls were getting 60 and $50 a
month.
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Barrett: Well, what was the difference, do you think? Why were they paying
you so high?
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O'Connor: Because I was like an engineer. Okay.
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Barrett: You were doing a lot of different kinds of work for them.
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O'Connor: I wasn't doing the stenographic work. I was doing mostly
engineering work. At the top with this. These three men.
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Barrett: But when you went to that business college, then one of the
things you learned was stenography. O'Connor: Yes.
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O'Connor: And typing. And that was supposed to be-- It took my sister two
years to do what I did in three months. I learned that shorthand so fast
that they took me out of the class, and this Miss Gallagher, she gave me
individual attention. Because, you know, I was wasting my time not to, you
know, to keep me back to the class.
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Barrett: Was that a very special skill at that time? I mean, did a lot of
did a lot of young girls.
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O'Connor: Yes, and that's where you went to Iron City College. And then it
became Duffs science in college.
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Barrett: And how long did you work for the telephone company? Do you
remember when that was?
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O'Connor: I worked for the telephone company in-- as an operator. I had to
two times with the Bell Telephone company. I was fired.
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Barrett: Really.
Barrett: Both times. O'Connor: No, I couldn't. Well, I worked for the
telephone company from September till Christmas.
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Barrett: And when was that? Do you remember? Like approximately what
year?
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It must have been about. I can't. Maybe 1927. But.
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O'Connor: I work at the telephone company as an operator. A friend of
mine, Marty Keller and I, we were supposed to work on Christmas Day. My
mother would not let me go to work on Christmas Day. So I just never went
back because I knew that they would fire me. Barrett: Yeah. O'Connor: So I
didn't go back. So. Time went on and I was looking for a job and I went and
applied for Bell Telephone Company. And on my application they said, have
you ever worked for the Bell Telephone Company previously, and I put N-O,
no.
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Barrett: Yeah.
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O'Connor: So I worked there.
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Barrett: And they hired you again then? O'Connor:Pardon? Barrett: They
hired you again?
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O'Connor: Yes, they hired me. And they slipped up on it. Yeah, they hired
me as a secretary. As a stenographer and I worked for this woman, and then
one day I was called in. One of the executives was in it. And I was such
a-- My typing was so even and I had the knack of when I would write a
letter I would have the same margin at the top, the same margin at the
bottom. Barrett:Yeah O'Connor: Everything was so perfect according to them.
So then one day I was called in, and there were five women sitting around
this table, and they told me that they were going to get me an executive
secretary job. But one of the stipulations that I would be, I would be up
in the executive offices, but I would have to wear better clothes, know it
was the Depression. Barrett: Yeah. O'Connor: And I would have to wear
better clothes than I was wearing. You know, I was just wearing ordinary,
you know. So my mother took me to Gimbels.
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And I got all outfitted out there and.
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O'Connor: They were so proud of me.
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Barrett: Yeah, Yeah.
O'Connor: And so I worked there for a year. And one day I went to the
restroom, and they had mirrors all along there and the wash spaces. I was
standing there washing my hands, and turn at the other end I saw this Mr.
Butler, for whom-- who had been my supervisor when I was pushing the plugs
in.
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Barrett: Yes. Yes.
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O'Connor: And she looked at me and I looked back at her. Not an hour
passed.
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Barrett: Oh, no.
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O'Connor: Till I was called up before all these women, and they just
called me a liar and a cheat and nothing, you know, just practically called
me that. And I was out on my ear. Barrett: Yeah. Yeah.
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Barrett: So but that was a pretty good job that you had so early then.
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O'Connor: That was a wonderful job. And I was so young. Barrett: Yeah.
O'Connor: And I had coal, black hair and it was wavy. And I had, still had
the rosy cheeks from Scotland.
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Barrett: I have a sister that looks like that.
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O'Connor: And everybody said that, you know, that I was so pretty, And and
they were they were really going to push me ahead they'll tell me. Yeah.
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Barrett: And was the telephone company considered a good place to work for
like girls, let's say your age? O'Connor: Oh, yes, yes.
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O'Connor: Especially if you got into stenography or secretarial.
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Barrett: Operating was kind of hard [inaudible].
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O'Connor: Yes, was hard. And most anybody can be an operator. Barrett:
Yeah, Yeah. O'Connor: But not everyone can be a good secretary.
Barrett:Yeah.
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Barrett: What kind of things were your friends doing? You know, like girls
your own age. If you didn't get a job as good as the one you had, what kind
of things were there? O'Connor: Well, now
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O'Connor: I had a friend that worked with me and Summersfittland Todd[??]
Company. She was getting $60 a month. I was getting 120. Barrett: Yeah
O'Connor: But I was sworn to secrecy. Yeah. And, but, she was just taking
shorthand and typing it and everything else where I was doing this
engineering thing. So.
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Barrett: Did some girls have to do factory work and things like that or?
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O'Connor: No, not none of my friends ever did that. They mostly were,
[inaudible], stenographers. I wouldn't say they were secretaries.
Stenographers. So then I went, from there-- to Summersfittland Todd Company
[??]. And. So while I was there, the Depression came. And every month, when
I was going down and down and down and salary, you know, they're cutting my
salary down until, it came down to $13 a week. And when I came home and
told my mother, she wouldn't let me go back. Because we weren't really too
hard hit with the Depression.
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Barrett: Your dad was still working? O'Connor: No.
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O'Connor: No, see that there was no work in the mills. He wasn't working.
But my brother James was with Lloyds, and he hadn't married yet.
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And my brother Pat was with
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O'Connor: Union Switch and Signal. My sister was still working for U&I
[??]. And I had been working, my sister was working on trusts. It was much
coming in. And many a basket went out of this house of food and and a
dollar, which my mother had always gives him a dollar, besides the basket.
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Barrett: You mean during the Depression other people would come here?
O'Connor: Yes. Barrett: And your mom would help them by giving them money.
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O'Connor: And she would give them lots of all kinds of things, because we
were not, we were not poor. Barrett: Yeah O'Connor: We were just one of the
fortunate people. And then she would give them a dollar. I remember one
woman came here, Mrs. Weathers, and her little girl had to have glasses.
And at that time you could get glasses-- an examination for a dollar. So my
mother would give, my mother gave her the dollar and told her
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Whenever she was to get the glasses well she would buy them for her.
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Barrett: Did people do that kind of thing a lot? Did they help each other
during the Depression?
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O'Connor: I don't think many people had much to help them.
00:22:08.000 --> 00:22:09.000
Barrett: They weren't in a position to do it.
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O'Connor: But you see, when my mother and father came here. They had-- in
cash-- they had over $5,000 with them. Barrett: Yeah.
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Barrett: Yeah. So that's an awful lot of money.
00:22:24.000 --> 00:22:41.000
O'Connor: That's a lot of money, and [uh]-- So they had-- It wasn't any
sacrifice for them to help people out.
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Barrett: Do you think your mom, when she did that [uhm]-- did she have,
like religious principles in mind?
00:22:53.000 --> 00:22:56.000
Barrett: I mean. O'Connor: No, she just had a good heart.
00:22:56.000 --> 00:22:59.000
Barrett: Not complicated, then. Yeah.
00:22:59.000 --> 00:23:01.000
O'Connor: She felt sorry for,
00:23:01.000 --> 00:23:07.000
A lot of those people.
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O'Connor: I go from there.
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Barrett: Well, let's see. This must be like during the 30s then, during
the Depression. O'Connor: During the Depression. Barrett: And you held on
to your job.
00:23:15.000 --> 00:23:29.000
O'Connor: So then I went to my oldest brother had married. He married a
girl from Homestead. And they. They went-- they were-- he was transferred
from Philadelphia to New York and he was in charge
00:23:29.000 --> 00:23:35.000
of that office. He was very bright.
00:23:35.000 --> 00:23:49.000
O'Connor: So they went to New York, while I went, and during the
Depression and I went to New York to see if I could get a job there. When
my mother made me quit [inaudible]. But in the meantime, I had taken a
civil service examination
00:23:49.000 --> 00:23:55.000
For the state.
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O'Connor: Well they had-- Secretaries were a dime a dozen. You know, I
went and I stayed in New York for nine weeks, during which time I worked
for Gimbels selling children's pajamas [laughs].
00:24:09.000 --> 00:24:12.000
Barrett: Sounds like you had to take what you can get, I guess. O'Connor:
Yes.
00:24:12.000 --> 00:24:17.000
O'Connor: And then I got a telegram from the
00:24:17.000 --> 00:24:26.000
State asking me to come for-- that I had been appointed, as a
stenographer.
00:24:26.000 --> 00:24:52.000
O'Connor: And I had to go to Harrisburg to work. So I went to Harrisburg.
Fortunately, a woman down in the neighborhood whom I didn't know, she came
down the path that I was going, and she came down with a letter of
introduction to her daughter. And her daughter met me at the train. And I
stayed with her that night and then the next day.
00:24:52.000 --> 00:25:09.000
The two of us got a room together. I was there for-- And I was only there
for--
00:25:09.000 --> 00:25:13.000
O'Connor: Eight months. And then I asked for a transfer
00:25:13.000 --> 00:25:18.000
Barrett: back to Pittsburgh, which they gave me. And I came back to
Pittsburgh. Barrett: This would be like the late 1930s?
00:25:18.000 --> 00:25:28.000
That was in [uh] I started with state in about 1929.
00:25:28.000 --> 00:27:13.000
O'Connor: Yeah, about 19-- 1930s. So I got into stenographic here. From
the day I came, the chief clerk there, she took a dislike to me. And I
could do nothing right. From the very first day I was there, I and, I knew
that I was you know, I was very good stenographer. And then it was the
enforcement division of the Liquor Control Board. For instance, whenever
these enforcement officers wanted a stenographer to dictate their reports
to, they would ask for me. And some of them, you know, dictate very fast.
And, you know, they couldn't, they couldn't throw me in some. Because as I
told you, I could space everything and everything. I had a very even touch
with the typewriter. And, you know, my stuff would go to Harrisburg and
this girl in Harrisburg told me, she said as soon as I looked at that, I
noticed whos report that is. Barrett: Yeah. O'Connor: Besides looking at
the initials. Barrett: Yeah. O'Connor: Well, I worked there in the
stenography pool and I had my ups and downs there with the [inaudible]. One
day they gave, a test, for a hearing stenographer. And I wasn't going to
take it, because I didn't want this traveling around to Punxsutawney to
Altoona.
00:27:13.000 --> 00:28:20.000
O'Connor: And that was part of the job. You had to go and take hearings. I
had at the last minute, this Mr. Chap, he came, he said, I want you to take
that exam, because in that 11th hour, he said, I-- he said, I have bets on
you, and I want you to take that exam. So I filled in the form and I took
it. And of course I got it, you know, I, I think it was a hearing, you
know, it was like in the courtroom. Barrett:Yeah. O'Connor: And, you know,
they had their witnesses and they had the attorneys and they were-- First
part was real fast. Well, I got that. You know, there's like nothing. And
then the last part, they slowed up, of the hearing. And of course, I got
it. I mean, I expected to. Barrett: Yeah. O'Connor: And, so I started, and
my mother was here alone. My mother. My father had passed away, everybody
else had gotten married. And my mother was here alone. One weekend I came
home and she said, Is this the way it's going to be?
00:28:20.000 --> 00:28:21.000
Barrett: She didn't go for that so much. Catherine: No.
00:28:21.000 --> 00:28:32.000
O'Connor: And I said yes. I said, Look how much money I'm making. She
said, I don't care about the money. She said, I want you to give that job
up.
00:28:32.000 --> 00:28:35.000
So I, you know, we
00:28:35.000 --> 00:28:38.000
O'Connor: Discussed it pro and con, you know, and.
00:28:38.000 --> 00:28:39.000
Barrett: The whole family, or just, you and your--
00:28:39.000 --> 00:28:46.000
O'Connor: Just my mother and I. So finally I gave in and
00:28:46.000 --> 00:28:53.000
I said, I'll tell them tomorrow. So on Monday I told the supervisor Mr.
Baxter. I said,
00:28:53.000 --> 00:29:22.000
O'Connor: I am going to give the earing stenographer job up. I said, I'm
gonna go back to the stenographic pool. He put his arms around me. He said,
Katie, they call me. That is the best news we've had. He said, the board
wants to set up a legal office here, and aside from you, there was nobody
else that we could name to take that. Barrett: Yeah.
00:29:22.000 --> 00:29:26.000
Barrett: So somebody wanted you back here really anyway.
00:29:26.000 --> 00:30:09.000
O'Connor: So we set, they set up the legal office, and then I worked for
the most wonderful attorneys. They were all. One was from-- two from
Washington County. Two from Westmoreland County, two from Beaver County and
two would come in on hearing days. But I didn't have to take the hearing
thing. I had to take their reports-- after the hearings. Reports and
recommendations. [Sneezes] Excuse me. Well, you know who did all their work
for them? And they would let me do the, make the decisions and do.
00:30:09.000 --> 00:30:13.000
O'Connor: All that kind of stuff. Barrett: How long did you do this job?
00:30:13.000 --> 00:31:13.000
O'Connor: And I worked on that job from 19-- I think from-- 1940 I would
say. [Coughs] And through January 26th. 19--
