WEBVTT
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Laura Buccelli: Uh, could you, first of all, give me your name and could
you spell it? Spell your last name?
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Joseph Sodini: Joseph Sodini. S-o-d-i-n-i.
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Buccelli: And your age? Sodini: 65. Buccelli: Would you tell me your place
of birth? The country, region and village.
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Sodini: I was born November the 23rd, 1910, in Pittsburgh.
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Buccelli: Okay. And could you give me the full maiden name of your mother
and would you spell it?
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Sodini: Adele Tambellini. T-a-m-b-e-l-l-i-n-i.
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Buccelli: And were there any name changes at all? Were the last names of
your family ever changed when they came into this country at all? Sodini:
Never. Buccelli: And then, of course, we know you're Italian. Can you tell
me what languages you speak and understand?
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Sodini: I speak Italian and English, but I understand and read much better
the Italian language.
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Buccelli: Okay. And would you tell us your occupation?
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Sodini: I'm a restaurant owner with my brothers.
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Buccelli: And also your--your religion and the specific parish you pertain
to.
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Sodini: I'm a Catholic and I belong to Saint Simon Jude in Greentree.
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Buccelli: And would you care to tell us what your political preferences
are?
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Sodini: I've been a Republican all my life.
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Buccelli: Okay. How long have you lived in Pittsburgh?
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Sodini: Well, I was born in Pittsburgh, and I lived here until I was eight
and a half. And I was brought over in Italy by my father. And I stood there
till I was 17 and a half and came back to Pittsburgh. And I've been here
ever since.
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Buccelli: And how long do you think you've been a member of the Lega
Toscana? How many years?
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Sodini: Well, I came over in 1928, and I think I joined maybe after six
months and not even a year. And I was a member till the end.
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Buccelli: Till the end. And it ended in 71, right?
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Sodini: It ended in the--just one second. Yeah. May 30, 1971. That was the
toast farewell dinner dance that I was chairman give for the Lega Toscana.
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Buccelli: Now we need a little information about your family history. Can
you tell me the birthplace of your parents? The country, the region, the
village.
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Sodini: My father and mother both they were born at Saint Alessio. That's
the province of Lucca. The region of Tuscany. My father--you want the age?
He was born in--in 1875. Yeah. And he died in 1949, on November the 23rd.
My birthday, in fact.
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Buccelli: Um, can you tell me what port of entry your parents came in to
this country.
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Sodini: In New York.
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Buccelli: And when they came here. Did they intend to stay here forever,
or did they intend to to make some money and return? What were their
intentions? Do you know that?
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Sodini: Oh, I think so. No. My father first came right after he finished
the army over there, which was in 1900, right at the turn of the century.
He came here and then he went back after--I don't know exactly. We could
figure. [sound of tape pausing] One thing I forgot to say that I'm a owner
of Sodini Brothers, Inc. In other words, we're three brothers. One is named
Paul, one Charles, and myself.
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Buccelli: And then we were talking about your parents coming to this
country.
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Sodini: Yes. My father came over in 1900. His first name was Cesare, and
they called him for a nickname, well, which he's known by Giano. Yeah. And
he went back to Italy in 1903 to marry my mother, Adele Tambellini. And
they came both came back to this country. And my mother died after having
five children in 1916. And my father took us all back to Italy in 1919. But
the idea of those people, they like our fathers and the Barsoli's fathers,
and the Tambellini's fathers and many more others, the idea was to come
over, try to make a capital, try to get some money, so they went back to
the land where they come from because it's--it's--they like it there. It
was their country. The language was very hard for them to learn and and
what they needed over there, they needed some money so they could get some
kind of a business. And that's exactly what happened. They mostly went
back. Of course, some stayed here.
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Buccelli: I think I had heard that your mother passed away in the flu
epidemic. Is that true?
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Sodini: No. My mother passed away of of about a childbirth. That was the
sixth child.
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Buccelli: I see. Okay. I was misinformed on that. Okay. So they--they
intended to go back then. There's always something that's interested me
that I've never been able to clear up. How did these people get the money
to come over here to begin with? The immigrants. How did they gather the
the money to.
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Sodini: Well, they some lend to them. There's people with money over
there, too. And they they scrapped the money and most of it, somebody lent
the other one and then they they give it back just like me. When I came
over, my dad gave it to me and I send him back the money. And of course, my
dad then I don't know where he got the money from, but he maybe he had it
too. Or maybe he borrowed from somebody.
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Buccelli: When? When your father was here, what? What did he do? Was he a
merchant as well?
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Sodini: Well, yes. He started to work on these in these food stores.
That's what the people those people from Saint Alessio, they they opened up
a store and they sell fruit. They sell--they had an ice cream parlor,
candy. It was the older one. They came over. There was some before my
father came over, for instance, an uncle of mine came over before him. And
when my dad came over, he went to work with him. Then he learned it. He
learned the business, and then later on he opened up his own business. And
these fruit stores, they were doing they were doing nice. They were making
a nice living and making some money too. But of course, my father in 1919,
he had the last store he had was on on Liberty Avenue, near Grant Street.
They used to be Lafay--Lafayette saloon in the corner and then my father
was next. And that was a very good store, but he had a partner with him,
but he lost the lease. The Pennsylvania Railroad owned that property and
for some reason he lost the lease. Then that was around 19, I think it was
around 1918, something like that. And he stayed here for a while. Of
course, he was a widower with five children and it wasn't easy. And he
decided to go over there, which my mother even told them when she passed
before she passed away to take the kids over there. And and we were--
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Buccelli: Who was taking care of you during this time?
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Sodini: Well, somebody by the name of see, my father took this this couple
in. They didn't have no children. Attilio and Italia, Tambellini. They took
care of us. They come live right with us. And they took care of us until we
went to Italy. When we went to Italy. Then my father had a sister, which
her name was Cecilia Sodini, and she lived in the old homestead house where
we had our business through a country store. And that's who who took care
of us then. But as the oldest one, Orlando reached the age of 17.5, 18, he
came back to America. Then Paul came back, which is the second boy
then--then I came back when I was 18.
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Buccelli: Can I ask you, why didn't you stay?
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Sodini: Well, because we saw that really we couldn't get too far over
there, that for everybody it wasn't enough. And and then I guess because we
were born here and we like to come back to the country where we were born,
then Charlie came over after me.
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Buccelli: This business you're talking about in St. Alessio? Then this
business was held by your father's family?
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Sodini: Oh, yes. My grandfather started it. And then when my father left,
my aunt Cecilia, the one who brought us up, she ran it. Then when we went
back, she taught us how to run this, we run the business, we were 15 years
old. First my oldest brother, and then he came away. He came to this
country and then Paul ran it for about three years. And then when he was 15
to about 18 and then he came over and then I ran it from 15 to about 18.
And I came over and then Charlie ran it, and then he came over. Then they
went. I guess after that, I think my sister took it over. She bought the
place of the family. Then my sister was married over there. She got married
over there and she stayed over there till and then she came over after
World War Two. In 1947, my dad came over. We called them before the war in
1939 to come over here for a visit. But then the war broke out and he never
got back. And he died in 1949.
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Buccelli: One interesting, really interesting fact is it seems that so
many of the Santa Alessi went into business here rather than going into the
steel mills on the construction or whatever. To what do you attribute that
to?
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Sodini: Well, there was a lot of them, they had some business inclined. Do
you know what I don't know exactly I can explain it to you. And when they
come over, there weren't those people like to go in--in a--in a steel mill
or places like that. They wanted more business. So they started what you
call an easy business because you didn't have to know too much language to
sell fruit and to sell candy. They point them to you and they give them and
the language, they really didn't have to know too much, see. Of course then
the first one started, then the one came over, they worked for him, see?
And then of course, they work and they learn it. Then they were in business
for themselves. And that's the way it went.
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Buccelli: Well, it seems like they really stuck together.
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Sodini: Yes, I would say yes. They they they. In other words, somebody was
coming over. They needed somebody they'd be glad to take and make him work.
And in the meantime, he learned. And then maybe later on, he went in
business for himself.
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Buccelli: Could you relate much with Southern Italians? Sodini: Pardon me?
Buccelli: Could they relate with Southern Italians?
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Sodini: Oh, yes, I would say yes. But of course I in those days it was a
little bit different. Yeah, than now. The southern Italians there, see,
they were more--down there they don't have--they didn't have any schools at
all. Of course, none of us had too much schooling, but they all had some.
Just like my father and all the older people, they had some schooling. But
down there was--there wasn't any schooling, not too much to speak of. And
of course, by not knowing even to write your name or anything, it's not
easy.
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Buccelli: Do you have difficulty understanding the dialect as well?
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Sodini: Oh, yes. If they speak their dialect, then forget it. You
can't--you can't understand it.
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Buccelli: What neighborhood did you move--you move into when you were in
Pittsburgh? Where did you live in the city?
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Sodini: When I come back myself, you mean?
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Buccelli: Well, first when your father was here. First, where did you
live?
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Sodini: Oh yeah, we lived there right up above the store, down on Liberty
Avenue. We lived down on Liberty Avenue. That's then from there, when he
lost the lease, we went to live. If I don't mistake, it was on Fourth
Avenue in some place. See? But we didn't stay long because he lost the
lease. He lost the store, say, in '18 and 1919 we went we went back over
there.
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Buccelli: And then when you came back, where did you live?
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Sodini: Well, when I came back, my two brothers was here and they lived
with a with a Beppina Barsotti. And she lived--we were living, in other
words, in their house. How do you say the board? Buccelli: Boarding.
Sodini: Boarding in their house and they were living there and she was
living then in Jasper Street in Mount Washington, which was a nice house
then. And of course I went to live there, too.
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Buccelli: So then your father's occupation, as far as you're concerned, it
would be a merchant, right?
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Sodini: I would say yes.
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Buccelli: Did your mother ever work outside of the home?
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Sodini: Not that I know of, no. She never worked, I'm sure.
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Buccelli: Did any kind of extra income come into the home other than what
your father brought in?
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Sodini: No, I would say just what my father brought in.
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Buccelli: And when you were working yourself, when you worked in the
restaurant business, did you have any part time jobs or outside jobs where
you made any extra money?
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Sodini: [laughs] You worked too long--you worked too long in the
restaurant! In those days, you worked 12 hours or more a day, so you don't
have no chance to get another job. It's not like now, eight hours--seven
hours and they're finished.
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Buccelli: Right. Okay. Would you, um, again, tell us how many brothers and
sisters you have?
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Sodini: I have, now I have two brothers and a sister, but one brother died
in 1940. His name was Orlando Sodini.
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Buccelli: Do you recall what it was like when you were a boarder? And did
you ever have boarders in your home when you had your own home?
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Sodini: No, I never--I never had boarders, No. Of course, my dad had
boarders when he was here. See, in those days, if you work in the store and
then if he was a single, they board in the house too. That's it. That's
what the wife done. The wife took care of the help because she had him
boarding in the house and she cooked him the meals and keep him clean and
everything. And they get so much a month and the board. That's the way they
work on those days.
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Buccelli: What was what was the atmosphere like when there was boarders in
the house? What kind of a--
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Sodini: Well, I really I don't remember that much because I was only about
what I would say about seven, seven and a half. I don't remember. I hardly
remember my mother. Only in way, you know, just a couple of times I can
recall her, that's all. I mean, I can recall the funeral that I recall.
See, because in those days it was they used to keep them in the house. And
what I remember best that there was two pigeons. And I'll never forget
those two white pigeon at the--at the near--casket, see. And but it's all I
remember, my mother. I hardly remember when she was living.
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Buccelli: I'm sure it--she died when you were very young. Sodini: Yeah.
Buccelli: Okay. How many children do you have and how old are they now?
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Sodini: I have two children. One Barbara, and she's a teacher and one
Orland--she's 29 and Orlando is 27 and he's a lawyer. In fact, he just got
married not too long ago. What was it, the 14th of February, 1970--this
year.
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Buccelli: Can you tell me now what kind of education you've had and
special training. And I think, too, it might be interesting to to bring out
right. At this point, the time that you spent in Italy was the time when
Mussolini was on the rise. So in effect, you did have some [laughs] kind of
special training in Italy, didn't you?
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Sodini: Yeah, well, as far as my education is concerned, it was really
interrupted because I was born here and I left, I was eight and a half, so
I had about two years and a half here. Then I went over there and I had to
start all over again because I didn't know the Italian language. So and I
had--
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Buccelli: You didn't speak Italian at home?
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Sodini: Yes, but not that much. And when you when we went over there, I
didn't know how to read or write Italian, so I had to start from the first
class again. And I and I went up as high as four years. And that's all.
See, I was about 15 and then I was working already running the store
because Paul came to this country, the older brother of mine. And yeah, in
that time that was back, that was 19. Well we went over there in 1919 and
when Mussolini started, I think he started, what, 1921 when he went to
power in in that year or '22, I'm not sure. And, in other words, after he
was in power, he started a lot of different associations according to the
age. Now, first he started with the Balilla, which when the kid was six
years old and by the way, balilla spells b-a-l-i-l-l-a once the kid was
six, they give him a black shirt and pants and but you had to buy them.
And, and he was a balilla till I think maybe 9 or 10 or 11, I'm not quite
sure. And then after that, then you were when you're teenage--say 13, you
become avanguardia, which that spells a-v-a n-q-u-a-r-d-i-a. Well, that's
the bigger kids then they had different they had to train like for war.
They had to train like, you know, soldiers and different things. And, and
they had meetings once a month and they always preached you, the fascist,
the fascist and all that. And they put it so much in your head that it's
all you know, you don't know nothing else. They brainwash you. Then we were
17, you become a facista. Then, of course, then you meet a different a
different I mean, with different people. And--and--and, of course and then
you are a facista. As long as it's--as long as you live. As long as
Mussolini was in power, there was a fascista. You were a fascista. And
don't better not get out of it either, because then you're in trouble.
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Buccelli: What happened to you if you didn't want to become a fascista?
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Sodini: Well, there was a lot of they they want to become--they--they
didn't become a fascista, but there were, in other words, they were looked
all the time. They kept their eyes on him. And--and--and then if he wanted
anything at the government, you know, different or different--different
offices of the government, he had a heck of a time. In other words, let's
put it this way, you can't fight them, join them. And that's exactly what
they done, even if they didn't like it. But they join them for their own
good.
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Buccelli: Okay. Were you ever required then to march in processions and
parades?
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Sodini: Oh, sure I was. One day they--one day some big shot was coming to
Viareggio, which is only, what, about 15km away from our place. And, uh, we
started early in the morning. They took us over there and then you the and
all day long and wait for this guy without eating or nothing. He didn't
come around until about to--to--to--to--how do you say it--to. He didn't
come out to the view all these balilla, avanguardia, fascista to about 4:00
in the afternoon and us waiting there for about at least six, seven hours.
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Buccelli: Okay. So that was [laughs] that was your special training. Now
then your first job was really you held your first job when you were a
teenager. You were you were in charge of that store, is that right?
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Sodini: Oh, yes. When I was about let's see. I would say not even 15. I
worked there before. But then when Paul came to this country, which he came
in 1925. Exactly. That's right. I was 15 years old. Yes. I would charge.
And I went even down downtown and buy the stuff through these wholesalers.
And of course, don't forget, my aunt always watch us. She always had our
eye open and see how we were doing, see. And she was a good teacher and
a--and a smart businesswoman, too. She was a good seamster, too. Very
good.
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Buccelli: And and then when you came to this country, what was the first
job that you had then when you came here?
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Sodini: Yeah. Then see, Bonini brothers, they don't come from the same
town, but not too far, I would say maybe, about 10km or 15km where we come
from. And they were in business already and there were, they had the
sandwiches shop and they had the, if I recall, they had five already in
1928 when I came over and I got my brother, my oldest brother worked for
them. He was a cook. Well, cook was you make sandwiches. All they had, they
didn't have no no meals or steaks, just sandwiches. That's all they had.
And and I went to work for them as a dishwasher. And I worked there for
about, oh, say about 9 or 10 months ahead. Nothing else I could do. I
couldn't speak the English, so I had to learn it the hard way. After 9 or
10 months, then I went to work in what you call--this Tambellini in South
Side still had the fruit store, what they called the fruit store with candy
and ice cream parlors. I went to work for him for a while. I worked for him
for about, oh, two or just 2 or 3 months. I got sick. I had rheumatic
fevers and I didn't work for almost a year. Then when I went back to work,
I went to work for the De Frate, then see De Frate worked for Bonini. He
learned it. Then he went in business for himself. In fact, he bought a--he
bought one place off of Bonini. Then he opened another one on Stanwix
Street. That's where I went to work. And I served--
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Buccelli: That's the same De Frate that has a place on on Liberty right
now today?
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Sodini: That's right. The same place. That's where I worked, too. From
Stanwix Street, then he closed that. He was in partnership with another
with Joseph Tambellini and the but I think it burned down, if I remember
right. Yeah. It burned. They never opened again. So he had a place on 10th
Street and Joseph Tambellini had a place on Wylie and Washington. Each one
went back to their own place. That was each one has their own there, see,
and the other was in partnership. And--and I went to work with Pete down on
10th Street, and I worked. That was where the bus station, the Greyhound
bus station used to be. He had a little counter there. That's the one he
bought from Bonini. He was working for Bonini and he bought that place. He
had a little counter, only sit about 12 people. But it was very busy while
the bus station was there. When the bus station went across the street on
on Liberty Avenue on the corner of Grant and Liberty. Then there was left
just a counter with a big room, but he still was there. He still stayed
there because we had a lot of business with those wholesale houses that
were there on Penn Avenue and he existing that he went in Italy, he got
married and I ran the place for him. Then when he came back, that's when he
moved to the corner. Then he he had a bigger place, but that's when I left
and in '32 and I bought and we bought with me and my brothers, we bought
this place up in Wilkins Avenue in Squirrel Hill where we still--we still
are now.
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Buccelli: Okay. You brought to mind a question that I've had in my mind
for a long time about these these immigrants that come over. How--what was
their philosophy or what were their thoughts about opening a business in
this country? What did they look for when they wanted to start a business,
for instance? And what were your thoughts about American people and how
they buy? Or, you know, do you--can you understand what I'm trying to?
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Sodini: Yes, I understand. Well. I wouldn't know how to answer that. What
was their philosophy. First, they--they--they learn so much and then they
thought they could do it.
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Buccelli: And well, for instance, your father, when he wanted to open the
business here, what did what did he look for to start up? You know, he had
to have some kind of a sense of of of a need that had to be, you know,
business need that had to be filled. Like what did he look for? And--
Sodini: I just didn't understand exactly. Buccelli: Well, we're getting
near the end of the tape. I'll turn it over. Yeah, yeah. Explain that. I
think we can get that on this side of the tape.
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Sodini: Yeah, well, see, when you say a different philosophy that they
had, it's hard to pick a place. In certain places, they just pick a place
and let's hope they go. Now, they felt, if you work for somebody else, you
got you got a salary, which is so much and maybe they might raise you a
little bit, but that's all you're going to make. In business, maybe you
don't make as much, but you got a good chance to make money then.
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Buccelli: You have a better chance to make-- [speaking concurrently]
Sodini: Oh, sure! Absolutely you-- Buccelli: --more money working for
yourself. Sodini: --get a better chance!
00:29:02.000 --> 00:30:02.000
Buccelli: Okay, we'll turn this over now.
