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Strasser: What was that last organization? Rosenthal: That's the
Children's Aid. Strasser: Children's-- Rosenthal: Of Jewish women. And
that's for retarded children. And they used to have--before the state or
the government would take care of the retarded children, we used to have a
class and pay for the teachers and take care of, provide traveling, pick
them up or bus service to pick the children up at the homes where the
children were never even get out. And we organized this group and we used
to have the Board of Education would give us a room in a school. Strasser:
What school? Rosenthal: We were at the Davis School and at the Larimer or
another school out in East End and I forget the name of it and where they
give us a school and we'd have a bus or taxi pick these children up. And it
was very convenient for the parents that took the children away for a few
for the day until 3:00 or 4:00. Strasser: This was once a week? Rosenthal:
Every day. Strasser: Every day? Rosenthal: Every day of the school day from
Monday to Friday. Strasser: That's very good. Rosenthal: And now, of
course, the Board of Education takes care of those children. So we're going
to look for another project where we could help the retarded.
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Strasser: And did the teachers teach voluntarily or?
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Rosenthal: No, we paid the teachers. We had teachers that we took that we
paid a teacher and an aide. And it all came from our raising the money.
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Strasser: You did that by petitioning or?
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Rosenthal: No. We raised the money with our dues and we'd have donors and
we'd have a tag day where the members would go out tagging and we'd have
different projects that we'd sell things and the profit would go to that or
bake sales and no--any way to raise money, to raise the money to support
these children. Take care of those children.
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Strasser: What do you think was the most important organization for Jewish
people when you were growing up?
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Rosenthal: Well, I'll tell you, every organization is important, no matter
whether they're Jewish or non-Jewish. It's--if it's an organization that
does nice work and helps others, it's a good organization.
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Strasser: You don't think there was one that was particularly-- Rosenthal:
No. Strasser: --effective?
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Rosenthal: Nothing effective. But every one that I belong to affected me
in a way that I wanted to join.
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Strasser: Did any of these organizations ever make help available to you?
Rosenthal: No. Thank God. Strasser: You never needed that. Rosenthal: No.
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Rosenthal: They may have when I was a young child, but I don't remember.
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Strasser: Do many of your friends now belong to-- Rosenthal: Yes--
Strasser: --Hadassah?
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Rosenthal: Most of my friends are from the organizations or from the
congregation. I belong to the congregation and I belong to the sisterhood
of our congregation. And the--the sisterhood helps maintain the
congregation in that we help support the congregation, too, also. So that's
worthwhile.
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Strasser: And was your husband a member of a fraternal. Rosenthal: Yeah.
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Rosenthal: Which he was an honorary from the Historian Society at Pitt
University. Strasser: What did he-- Rosenthal: He was a member of the Tree
of Life Congregation. He was a member of the B'nai B'rith and he was a
member of the Federation.
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Strasser: Was he ever an officer of any sort?
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Rosenthal: Oh, yes.
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Strasser: What were his positions?
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Rosenthal: He used to install new members in different groups. And I
remember that--and he was a Mason.
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Strasser: He was a Mason? Rosenthal: Mhm. Strasser: How long was he a
Mason?
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Rosenthal: Oh, I don't know. Many years. Maybe 30 years.
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Strasser: Was he ever employed by the Masons? Rosenthal: No.
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Rosenthal: [??] he was only employed at the Tree of Life. Then he was
employed at Allderdice High School, and we--it wasn't sufficient funds to
raise a family when the children started to go to school. So he taught at
Allderdice. And then he after school, he taught the Hebrew school at the
Tree of Life. And during the last war, World War Two, he worked on the
graveyard shift at J&L. That was from 11:00-- Strasser: To 7:00? Rosenthal:
To 7:00. And I used to say, Marcus, go to sleep, Marcus, get up. [laughter]
That was the--
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Strasser: Extent of your conversation.
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Rosenthal: Yeah, well, he wanted to do something. He was a chemist in
analyzing steel. He majored in chemistry at school. So he helped out that
that way during the war.
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Strasser: Was he a member of a labor union?
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Rosenthal: No.
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Strasser: And was he active in the Masons?
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Rosenthal: I don't know how active, he went to the meetings.
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Strasser: The Great Depression of the 30s had an effect on almost everyone
being in America at the time.
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Rosenthal: Sure, we were affected.
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Strasser: How was your life affected, could you say?
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Rosenthal: Sure it was affected. We didn't get paid for months and months,
and then they asked my husband to go around and collect some of the dues
from the members that could afford to pay for the congregation. And then
they become part of his salary so we could live on. Strasser: Yeah.
Rosenthal: Yeah. Everybody was affected. [laughter]
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Strasser: In any other way?
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Rosenthal: Well, there's some that weren't. Of course, if they had big
savings and. And thank God we managed through. I always saved the little
and whatever earnings we had, we always had enough to help others and save
a dollar here and there.
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Strasser: Do you notice any changes occurring in Hadassah? Rosenthal: What
do you say? Strasser: Did you notice any changes occurring in Hadassah or
the Pioneer Women at this time?
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Rosenthal: No. They are progressing.
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Strasser: Possessing. And have you kept any contact with Austria,
writing-- Rosenthal: No-- Strasser: --or visiting? And did your father?
Rosenthal: --I don't know of any.
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Rosenthal: Oh, my father has been dead over 35 years, so I don't
remember.
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Strasser: Did your husband?
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Rosenthal: My husband had lost his parents during Hitler time. And then he
didn't have anybody to write to.
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Strasser: And can you tell me what synagogue you belong to and how often
you attend it?
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Rosenthal: I belong to the Tree of Life Synagogue. Wilkins and Shady. And
I attend all the high holidays and whenever I have a chance, I go on the
Sabbath.
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Strasser: Can you tell me the role of the rabbi? Of your rabbi at the Tree
of Life. Uh, his reactions to the World Wars?
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Rosenthal: Rabbi's reactions? Well, we'd like to see peace on the world.
[laughs] And he would, too. It's Rabbi Kaplan whose rabbi of the Tree of
Life Today.
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Strasser: And was he the rabbi during the World Wars?
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Rosenthal: No. Rabbi Halperin-- Strasser: Halperin. Rosenthal: --was
rabbi.
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Strasser: Did he encourage Americanization?
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Rosenthal: Oh, I don't know his views, but we all wanted peace. And I
don't think there was anybody that would want war.
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Strasser: Do you remember the differences between Rabbi Zivits and Rabbi
Ashinsky?
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Rosenthal: Rabbi Zivits and Rabbi Ashinsky. I knew Rabbi Ashinsky. And my
husband knew Rabbi Zivits because he used to like to study with him. You
mean that there was any difference between them?
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Strasser: Well, they had, I think, a difference about Americanization.
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Rosenthal: Oh, they loved America. They had freedom. And that was what
everybody that migrated to America, that left their native land, was to
have freedom. And that's why they came here.
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Strasser: How did the World Wars affect you as a Jewish person?
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Rosenthal: World War and I lost my baby brother in the last war in the
Navy. He enlisted because he wanted to help. He was in the D-Day invasion.
He was the dearest thing to me. And we lost him in the last war. But he
wanted to fight to bring peace.
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Strasser: But do you feel that affected you as a Jewish person or as.
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Rosenthal: Well, we are Americans. We're Jews and we're Americans. And he
was born in America and this was his country. And when when they were at
war and he wasn't of age to go in to the war, but he used to ride the bus
or the streetcar at that time. And he when he'd be on the bus and there was
any women or mothers or sisters, he'd think that they were looking at him
and they he saw a question in their face, What are you doing here? When
maybe they had somebody over there and he come home and he wasn't even of
age. I had a sign for him to enlist and he was due to come out of the
service just a few months later. And he had passed away in the San Diego
Hospital. Coming back from overseas and got dysentery and and he complained
of pain and they gave him pills to physic him and ate up his intestines
when he got dysentery. And instead of getting medication and being on a
diet, they gave him these physic pills. And one day he was in San Diego
where he took sick and they rushed him to the hospital. And there his
intestines broke through. They wired me and I flew up there. Was 30--1945
is when he passed away. September 14th.
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Strasser: Have you saved any money or insurance? Rosenthal: What'd you
say? Strasser: Have you ever had an insurance policy or saved any money
with--or did your husband with the Masons? With the fraternal?
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Rosenthal: Insurance with the Masons? No. Well, we had a private insurance
policy, Metropolitan I think.
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Strasser: And did he ever borrow money from any of those?
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Rosenthal: Did we borrow money? Never borrowed money. Never.
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Strasser: Make ceme--
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Rosenthal: I never. [laughs] I never bought anything that I couldn't
afford. [laughs]
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Strasser: That's a good policy.
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Rosenthal: Never had a charge account. Didn't want any. Strasser: Yeah.
Rosenthal: Because when I saved up the money and I needed something, I
bought it and paid cash.
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Strasser: Have you made cemetery arrangements with any of the
organizations you belong?
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Rosenthal: Cemetery? Yes, With the Tree of Life.
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Strasser: The Tree of Life. Rosenthal: Yeah. Strasser: Who else would you
go to at a time of need if you couldn't go to--or if your husband couldn't
go to the Masons or you to Hadassah? Was there anyone you'd go to?
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Rosenthal: What do you mean?
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Strasser: In a time of need, if there was some emergency and you needed
large sums of cash, say.
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Rosenthal: Money? Never needed anything. Always had enough. What I need.
What I wanted. And what I couldn't afford, I didn't want. [laughs]
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Strasser: Uh, can you-- the ethnic group of your husband, he was Jewish?
Rosenthal: Yes. Strasser: And your children are both--
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Rosenthal: Jewish. Married Jewish.
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Strasser: And your brothers and sisters?
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Rosenthal: Yeah, they are married. Well, I lost two sisters and a brother
within the last ten years. My sailor brother I lost in 1945.
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Strasser: What was the most crucial aspect of being Jewish when you were
growing up?
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Rosenthal: There was no crucial aspect. It was just the way of life. And
that's what I was born to and that's what I lived.
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Strasser: Did any aspects of the American culture come into conflict with
conflict with your upbringing?
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Rosenthal: No. Nobody interfered. I leave people alone if they leave me
alone. [laughs]
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Strasser: Wow.
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Rosenthal: I don't criticize those Jewish people that are Reformed or
although I'm Orthodox and I belong to a Conservative congregation because
my husband was affiliated with them. But that don't bother me. I leave them
do what they want and I do what I want.
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Strasser: Mm hm. Everyone's happy.
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Rosenthal: I observe the Sabbath. I don't write on Saturday, work on
Saturday.
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Rosenthal: They do what they want to do. And if I can walk to the
services, I walk on Saturday. If it's bad weather, I don't go. I stay home
and pray. [laughs]
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Strasser: Um, do you feel there's a difference in the role of women in
Hadassah now than there was when you first joined?
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Rosenthal: No, they were all looking out to help the organization those
days, and they still do today, but they're full hearted. You know, Hadassah
workers. So they same thing. But just like mothers take care of their homes
before. Of course, today it's different. Today it's going out to eat is a
big deal. To me, making a meal at home is a better deal.
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Strasser: What ethnic group do you feel closest to your own? Uh, for
instance, would you identify with the Italian strongly?
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Rosenthal: I have neighbors and I've had neighbors in where I've lived
with Gentiles, Italians, Hungarians, and I was very close with all of them,
Irish people, and we got along wonderful.
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Strasser: Did you feel--
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Rosenthal: They used to tell me their religion, I used to tell them mine.
We'd exchange recipes and of course I couldn't eat everything they made
because it wasn't kosher. But then they'd understand. And I had friends
that even if they--if I would come to their place for dinner, they would
buy kosher meat and kosher--make certain things to, so I could join them.
And I did the same thing with them.
00:17:18.000 --> 00:17:25.000
Strasser: But there's not one that you feel is--of your friends
upbringings, whether they're ethnic or cultural--
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Rosenthal: If they are upright people, no matter who they are or what they
are, they are human beings and we're all God's children. And it never
mattered. No religion never mattered to me. I respected them. I honored
their holidays. And it used to be on a Sunday, I wouldn't do my washing
because I lived in a gentile neighborhood to hang out the wash, just as I
wouldn't do mine on the Sabbath.
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Strasser: I think what this question is inquiring about, though, is
whether in the strict upbringing of Orthodox Jewry, if you feel there's any
other religious or nationality group that would be similar to that.
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Rosenthal: No, no, none of them matter to me. I'd let them just whatever
they want to keep as long as they're honest people. That was personal with
me. I do the way I--what I think is right. And, of course, if anybody
didn't have a good name or didn't do right, I wouldn't associate with them.
I just had nothing to do with them. But if they were nice neighbors, I had
wonderful neighbors. They would do anything for me and I would do the same
for them. And I don't care what they were.
00:19:04.000 --> 00:19:11.000
Strasser: How does membership in your organizations affect your position
in the Jewish community? Do you think it does?
00:19:11.000 --> 00:19:19.000
Rosenthal: The membership isn't high-- Strasser: No-- Rosenthal: It's
annual membership. You want to know the membership of Hadassah?
00:19:19.000 --> 00:19:24.000
Strasser: No, how your membership in it affects-- Rosenthal: No--
Strasser: --your role in the community.
00:19:24.000 --> 00:19:48.000
Rosenthal: No, it's very little. And if I could help them in any way, why
I'd do it. You can get a life member for $150 and you're members for life.
But I already paid out so many life members that I just want to pay $10 a
year as long as I live. [laughs]
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Strasser: Do you think it's helped your family or your education or your--
Rosenthal: No. Strasser: --marriage?
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Rosenthal: It broadens my education. We have current events and we discuss
different things at meetings and situations and that broadens your mind.
Different points of view. Now, the most of the meetings is all that we have
to raise our money and it's from our own families that we gather.
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Strasser: What class do you identify with?
00:20:29.000 --> 00:20:54.000
Rosenthal: What class today? I'm middle class. Strasser: Middle class?
Rosenthal: Yeah. I consider that. I thank God I live comfortable. I do
everything myself as long as I'm able. And as you see, I considered middle
class, you know.
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Strasser: And you-- Rosenthal: Today. Today. Strasser: --consider
yourself. Right.
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Rosenthal: Well, when you start from poor and you go up to middle class,
you're rich. [laughs] Right? Strasser: Right.
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Strasser: Do you feel your membership in the organization has affected
your chance of moving to a higher class?
00:21:11.000 --> 00:21:15.000
Rosenthal: Oh no. I don't want to go to higher as long as I'm
comfortable.
00:21:15.000 --> 00:21:21.000
Strasser: And do you think it affected you getting to middle class from a
poorer class?
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Rosenthal: Well, when I was able to work myself up and saved and live a
little better life, the only way. How--how did I get it? By working and
saving. And my husband was never a big earner, you know, until when we
needed to send the children to college and we needed more. So he took
another position, and I was home and I had my whole family lived with me,
my sisters and brothers living with me. And I took them out of the
orphanage.
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Strasser: Did any of--
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Rosenthal: And my sister even brought a little girl that she was
befriended in the orphanage that they decided they'd lived together. And
this little girl came to my house when I didn't have no room for her. And
she says, Ida, I have no place to go. I only--your home is my home. I said,
but I have no place for you to sleep. She said, I'll sleep on the floor.
Well, the next day I was hunting a room just to sleep in the neighborhood
for until I got--that's why I bought a big home, paid it out and had the
whole family lived together. We were the happiest family you ever came
across.
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Strasser: Did any of your brothers or sisters earn money to help keep--
00:22:45.000 --> 00:23:42.000
Rosenthal: When they worked, they paid their share. When they didn't work,
when they didn't earn, that was their home. And when I could hear a strange
child. The young girl that lived with me. And when we was furnishing the
home and she sat on the stairway and she said, Oh, our home will be
beautiful. Well, that was worth to me everything. When she was orphaned
from the orphanage and when a strange child could say, Our home will be
beautiful, which it was beautiful. Not because it was furnished, it wasn't
so furnished, so beautiful. But with every chair that I bought or
everything that I got in, she admired. And she was so happy with it that
our home was beautiful because it was peaceful and it was love for one
another.
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Strasser: Where did you buy your house?
00:23:43.000 --> 00:25:31.000
Rosenthal: And we lived on Piddock Street. Strasser: Piddock? Rosenthal:
Piddock, it was right across Taylor Allderdice High School. And when I--we
moved in, I didn't have no furniture or nothing. It was a big nine room
house and needed cleaning and painting and--and the first day we moved in,
we, I put a sheet on the floor and we bought some cold cuts and bread and
we sat and we made sandwiches on the floor. We had a meeting that time. And
my children used to bring up the meeting, that meeting all the time. And my
sisters and brothers used to say, Well, I told them, look, my husband's
sister lives with me, lives with us, my two children, my sisters and
brothers, this little girl that moved in, I says, we're just going to have
a meeting and I'm going to tell you how it's going to be where so many
different groups in this home. I says, None of us is going to be perfect.
We're all going to have different ideas, we're all going to do at one time
or another a wrong thing or say the wrong thing. But I want you to know
this, that if any one of us does anything wrong and you see it or I'll see
it, we'll bring it up and we'll tell it to each other and forget it. And I
says, let this group be one for all and all for one. And we were the
happiest family on our street. All our neighbors used to admire our group.
It was just like a party house. We had 10, 12 people living in the house.
00:25:31.000 --> 00:25:32.000
Strasser: How long did you live there?
00:25:32.000 --> 00:25:45.000
Rosenthal: 36 years. Strasser: [?????] Rosenthal: Raised, married some of
them, buried some of them from there. It was good and bad, but it was all
for one and one for all.
00:25:45.000 --> 00:25:49.000
Strasser: And you moved from there to here? Rosenthal: To here. Strasser:
When was that?
00:25:49.000 --> 00:25:52.000
Rosenthal: Three years ago. I'm living in this apartment.
00:25:52.000 --> 00:25:57.000
Strasser: Right. Not very long ago.
00:25:57.000 --> 00:26:09.000
Rosenthal: No. Just past three years. Going to be four years in
Jul--August.
00:26:09.000 --> 00:26:14.000
Strasser: How has membership in The Tree of Life affected your position in
the Jewish community?
00:26:14.000 --> 00:26:53.000
Rosenthal: Well, when my husband retired, I got a life membership. But I
contribute every year to the congregation because I know the needs of the
congregation, especially today, the teachers and the staff and the upkeep
of the school. But I contribute every year my share, which I don't have to
if I don't, if I can't afford it. But as long as I can afford it, I
contribute. And I'm looked up as an honorary member.
00:26:53.000 --> 00:27:03.000
Strasser: Has your--are members of your organization's upper class, would
you consider them?
00:27:03.000 --> 00:27:11.000
Rosenthal: They're in all walks of life.
00:27:11.000 --> 00:27:23.000
Strasser: Do you think membership or leadership in any of your
organizations affects your position outside of the Jewish community? Other
people take note of-- Rosenthal: No. Strasser: --your activity.
00:27:23.000 --> 00:27:37.000
Rosenthal: No, there's no activity. It's only an organization that does
good. We have no kind of secret organizations or anything like that. It
it's only for the good.
00:27:37.000 --> 00:27:40.000
Strasser: Do you remember the old Irene Kaufmann Center?
00:27:40.000 --> 00:27:41.000
Rosenthal: Oh, yes, sure.
00:27:41.000 --> 00:27:42.000
Strasser: Tell me about it.
00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:44.000
Rosenthal: Oh, the old Irene Kaufmann Center.
00:27:44.000 --> 00:27:46.000
Rosenthal: I used to go to Sunday school there.
00:27:46.000 --> 00:27:47.000
Strasser: When you were little?
00:27:47.000 --> 00:28:14.000
Rosenthal: Yeah. And, uh, then I used to go to where they had classes like
gym and. Like after school where the children would go. I think we had the
sewing class where I learned a little bit of sewing there, but I knew
sewing. I used to sew when I helped my father.
00:28:14.000 --> 00:28:17.000
Strasser: Do you remember Anna B. Heldman?
00:28:17.000 --> 00:28:20.000
Rosenthal: Hellman. Miss Hellman?
00:28:20.000 --> 00:28:23.000
Strasser: Anna--Anna B. Heldman?
00:28:23.000 --> 00:28:27.000
Rosenthal: Heldman. Yeah, sure. I knew her personally. I was just a young
girl.
00:28:27.000 --> 00:28:33.000
Strasser: Well, what did she do? I haven't met anybody who knew her.
Rosenthal: You never met anyone that knew her? Strasser: No.
00:28:33.000 --> 00:28:35.000
Rosenthal: She was a wonderful person.
00:28:35.000 --> 00:28:37.000
Strasser: She worked at the settlement?
00:28:37.000 --> 00:29:12.000
Rosenthal: Sure. And I think mostly as a--at the health center, if I
remember, because we used to take our children down to get weighed and and
to be examined, because in those days, we didn't go to a pediatrician or to
a doctor with anything. You know, when they we needed their checkups. You'd
go to the Irene Kaufmann settlement and and take the children down. That's
what my sisters and brothers were babies.
00:29:12.000 --> 00:29:17.000
Strasser: And what did--what did Miss Heldman do? She was director of it?
00:29:17.000 --> 00:29:33.000
Rosenthal: She was director of, I think of the Health because she was. Oh,
she was-- Strasser: Always around? Rosenthal: Yeah. At the Irene Kaufmann
Center. It's still left, isn't it? Strasser: Has it moved? Rosenthal: I
haven't been for years on Centre Avenue.
00:29:33.000 --> 00:29:35.000
Strasser: I think it's moved. But I, I--
00:29:35.000 --> 00:30:35.000
Rosenthal: Well the Irene Kaufmann Center, no, it's still there. Strasser:
It's still on Centre? Rosenthal: Yeah, it's still there. It was a lovely
building. And then I remember we didn't have a bath house at when I was a
little girl. We didn't have a bath in our house and we used to go to the
Irene Kaufmann settlement. I think for $0.05 you'd get a bath. Strasser:
Oh, that's nice. Rosenthal: Yeah, you'd pay. Get a shower maybe twice a
week. My--we used to take the children down and, well, when I was grown
already, I used to bathe the children in the tub and the bathtub and the
wash tub, you know, and it just sort of keep them clean. I'd bathe them a
couple of times a week and my mother was sick and I used to wash their
clothes because we didn't have too much clothes. We didn't have too much
changes like today, cupboards full, drawers full of clothing, you know, in
those days you didn't have it. And I remember used to bathe them and then
keep the water.
